So, I sat down and crunched the numbers after thinking about Khorne in the new book. So…
Khorne bloodletters went down 6 points, but lost an attack and toughness. Throw in a herald for 55 points on juggernaut with a loci of rage which costs 65 and you have a 120 point herald. The new unit is now 320 points with 20 bloodletters with 3 attacks on the charge. This is the same attacks, WS, and S as old daemons for the exact same cost. Only now, they are T3 and lose two attacks after the first round of combat instead of one. So with a straight herald, they just simply aren’t as good as they used to be.
But wait, what is this Chariot. At first glance it struck me as an absolutely terrible unit throwing a herald all by his lonesome. But what the chariot allows is a broader decision base and, should it be needed, cheap massed loci. Instead of a single unit that must he forced into the assault it allows a bubble that can be flexed in any direction to essentially threaten most of the table.
So, here was the results of the list I picked.
Well, I played against Deathwing. Other than the brutal anti-infantry lists that Tau can produce, especially now, Terminator lists are about the bane of Khorne in general. Hard to kill, lots of S8 stuff, a pretty good amount of shooting, and lots units with higher base attacks than even Khorne units. Many other shooting armies kill a lot upon approach and then crumble. Deathwing…yeah, not so much so. So, he had 20 terminators, 5 tac marines, a Storm Eagle, a librarian, and a deathwing master.
So, here is the table we played on with 3 objectives. Two objectives were near the train and the third was at the railroad junction. It was the book mission Crusade with the vanguard deployment.
So, we both deployed, I went first.
I opted for a broad line with my hounds anchoring my flanks for a reaction force while the thirster and the crushers are in the middle along with the bloodletters and chariot. My plaguebearers and soulgrinder hold the rear.
He opts to drop in on turn one with his Deathwing assault. This is where he gives up the game by making a gregious tactical error… and drops his 10 man terminator with the librarian and Deathwing master. His combined shooting at the thirster puts 2 wounds on him.
During my turn the deathwing assault is struck by both squads of hounds (1 with rage), the red squad of bloodletters, and the bloodthirstere.
Prior to the assault, he lost 2 terminators to the baleful torrent and one of the lance shots. Of the remaining 8, 7 die in the resulting combat while he inflicts only 3 or 4 wounds. Combined with the banner, I handily win combat. The next two assault phases sees him losing the librarian, terminator SGT, and Deathwing master.
After this, he is really in trouble. The crushers and one squad of hounds destroy one of the remaining five man terminator squads.
The last terminator squad advances while the storm eagle lands to dump out its tactical marines before being wrecked by the baleful torrent. The remaining terminators face a brutal assault from the crushers, thirster, and hounds.
While the blue bloodletters assault and eat the tatical squad, removing the last threat of deathwing on the table.
Overall, I did not lose any full units. The win was so complete solely for the poor deepstrike placemennt of my opponent which, upon discussion he very fully realized. The open area to my rear or left flank would have offered a much more destructive location to deepstrike IMO. However, the Chariot allowed a very broad decision making platform and performed exactly how I wanted it. It allowed me to threaten most of the table from the fast units surrounding it and through stringing it out. Also, the importance of banners of blood has become more and more evident to ensure that critical assault is made.
Overall, a fun game. Looking forward to developing my mono-khorne force more with the new codex.
Thanks for reading,
So last Wednesday I played a game against a DE player with my daemons and CSM list. I ended up winning by a large margin but it more importantly it led me to realizations (as well as a conversation with a fellow player while I was outside smoking).
So, for the battle report. Played the mission “Vendetta” which is basically a kill point mission with a special mission that is rolled randomly. It is a CSM altar of war mission. On that note, I strongly suggest the altar of war books as they are pretty cheap for 6 missions for your army specifically and they offer a lot of new cool ideas. That said, the special mission was a selected unit was worth 3 battle points, each other destroyed unit was worth 1 battle point.
The battle went well for me. A few key factors sharply turned the tides of battle in my favor.
– Sorcerer of Tzeentch- Pairing this guy with thousand sons at ML 3 makes this a tough group to bring down. With telepathy it gives me 2 shots at getting invisibility. With the 3+/4++ on the squad and the cover bonuses giving me a 2+ cover most of the time it made them an ominously advancing fire sink.
– Screamers and herald of tzeentch- This unit served very well as a fast moving threat to get up into the enemies face and, with the grimoire of true names, ran around with a 3++ with rerolls of 1.
-The Nurgle soul grinder acts as an attractive fire sink. It’s effectiveness however is very limited. The time to adopt a unit such as a forgefiend may have arrived for something that can bring the pain at a distance with either the hades autocannons or ectoplasma cannons.
– Plaguebearers should be held in reserve to ensure their ability to participate where needed.
At the end of the battle, I had planned other combinations-
– Warp Talons of Tzeentch with grimoire for 2++
– Skyshield landing pad with a poraglyph
– A tally list supported by an aegis defense line.
Ultimately, all of the combinations are hardly broken or OP. In fact, they are very gimmicky. Some have tried to say that the list is balanced or that the book is strong. I have decided frankly that is has found itself lacking. The troops and named greater daemons went down in price…and that is it. Everything else went up or stayed the same in price, received a general hit to ability, and the book lost nearly all of it’s actual shooting attacks. Combine this with the fact that GW seems to have abandoned the book results in a straight-up weak codex. I am also hardly the only player that feels this way. Now that the initial hurrah and intrigue at shiny new toys has worn off the reality of the book has sunk in. With the lack of shooting and the lack of grenades, daemons face the harsh reality against emerging armies such as Tau and new armies such as Dark Angels that we simply lack the punch to dominate the field. But that really doesn’t bother me too much. Prior to the release of the book my single biggest fear was a super powered codex that EVERYONE played. I enjoy being the minority army. It makes my projects that much more interesting. It is one reason I am happy that so many abandoned CSMs quickly as they realized that they were hardly the one-click chaos win that some had hoped for. With only three players at my local shop that play daemons, all three of us have had mixed success with the book. One, a heavy Tzeentch player is a strong player and already owned many of the now very fast units that can get up and in your face quickly such as fiends and seekers as well as screamers, flamers, and chariots. The other player is a heavy, almost exclusively, Nurgle player. My issue with Nurgle is that a) it will not hold up against strong assaults (seen it happen… it’s true) and b) it’s even more flavorless now than before. Lastly there is myself who previously played a list that would dump a metric ton of units in close and assault under the premise of “You can’t kill them all”.Problem is this: I have to abide by the 50% reserve rule now which means that yes…I can dump half my army next to you, but it will be on turn 2, it will likely not all be at the same time, and lastly is this: they are on their own and will not have the other half following on their heels.
My counter to this I suspect will be to take small cheap CSM units to pad the other 50% and allow me to deepstrike more daemon units.
Well, thanks for reading,